PD and Windows Mobile 2005
- Thread starter sfrrr
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A
Anonymous
Guest
Just curious since I know from your other postings you are much more familiar with the pda (and other technology) world than I, which phone are you leaning towards? I will be a first time pleco buyer but am holding off until I can combine the purchase with a new WM2005 phone (I am really hoping for wifi. Wifi and pleco will make me very happy. 
)
JV
)JV
Guest--if that question was directed at me, I was very happy to hear about the Windows Mobile Treo 650 cominhg to a store near you soon. But I don't think I've used the HP Mobile PDA and really liked it, but the way HP implemented the combo was awkward--too many steps to do anything and not enough memory. oops, have to go. More later.
Sandra
Sandra
A
Anonymous
Guest
smartphones and Pleco
Sorry about that, yep, the question was directed to you, Sandra. I have been thinking about the Treo 700 -- wish the wifi was internal bec. the phone looks clumsy with the wifi card stuck in it. My guess is that is not a combo you would want to carry around all the time. But I can't tell if any of the other Windows mobile 2005 phones being talked about have a screen you can write on, essential for the Pleco, and wifi capability. I'll keep researching it but would be interested in any insights/thoughts you have.
Jane
Sorry about that, yep, the question was directed to you, Sandra. I have been thinking about the Treo 700 -- wish the wifi was internal bec. the phone looks clumsy with the wifi card stuck in it. My guess is that is not a combo you would want to carry around all the time. But I can't tell if any of the other Windows mobile 2005 phones being talked about have a screen you can write on, essential for the Pleco, and wifi capability. I'll keep researching it but would be interested in any insights/thoughts you have.
Jane
Jane--the short answer--and my only answer right now--is that although I'm fascinated by PDA-cell phone combos while I'm testing them, none of them has enough memory, good enough sound, convenient enough design, sharp enough screens...you get the drift...to be worthy of my very own money. I.e. I like 'em when I test 'em, but, right now, I have the dream PDA (Axim x51v running Windows Mobile 5) and no smartphone, not even the Treo 700, can come close.
A combo is my dream--I'm tired of carrying around all this stuff. But it's not here yet.
I check the smartphone I have to remind myself of the memory capacity and screen. As I recall neither is suitable.
Sandra
A combo is my dream--I'm tired of carrying around all this stuff. But it's not here yet.
I check the smartphone I have to remind myself of the memory capacity and screen. As I recall neither is suitable.
Sandra
Park He Lin
Member
K-Jam installation problem
Installation of the basic demo does not appear to work on my K-Jam with WM5. After installation and upon pressing the PlecoDict icon I am told no dictionary is available. Pressing the icon again brings up a screen with only an entry box and a menu. I installed-deleted-installed again with the same result.
Installation of the basic demo does not appear to work on my K-Jam with WM5. After installation and upon pressing the PlecoDict icon I am told no dictionary is available. Pressing the icon again brings up a screen with only an entry box and a menu. I installed-deleted-installed again with the same result.
Hmm... well as I said, we haven't actually tested this on WM5 hardware yet, but this is still rather odd. You're using Beta 2, correct? Can you try installing the dictionaries to main memory instead of to your flash memory card and see if that helps matters? (or if you already were installing them to main memory, install them to flash)
Also, which language is this K-Jam localized for? Do the "Program Files" and "My Documents" folders appear with English-language names, or are the names localized to some other language?
Also, which language is this K-Jam localized for? Do the "Program Files" and "My Documents" folders appear with English-language names, or are the names localized to some other language?
A
Anonymous
Guest
Mike--First and easiest--now that I have PD working nicely on the Aximx51v, could you please review what must stay in main memory and what can be returned to my storage card? (Or am I the WM5 guinea pig who has to figure this out?)
Now, a preliminary WM5 report. PlecoDict opens incredibly much faster. A second, maybe. On my x50v, it takes a loooong several seconds.
The tone three pinyin font problem isn't as obvious--the other letters are bold, the third tones are halfway between bold and normal.
The tapping on a character from the list and going directly its definition is the same. If it's the first character in the list, I have to hit the list toggle button. Otherwise, I tap on one of the results in the list and poof, there's the definition. To return to the list, I have to tap on the toggle again. I can't get any screen tap to switch me back to list mode.
And there are the all-too-frequent times when I type in a word, tap on its definition and then can't get back to the list,k not with the toggle, not with taps. I just have to type in a new word and then I go to its definition and can't get out of definition mode and back into list mode. (Using buttonss, taps or drop-down menu--nothing works.)
When I'm stuck in definition mode, the up and down arrows appear (and, yes, work), but I far prefer the list. Also, I have tried to replace the arrows in the toolbar with just about anything else, but to no avail.
I suggest you put a provision in your code to avoid skinning. I'm running WA2 and WAD with one of the Windows Vista themes so popular on the SBSH and Lakeridge forums and it made PD's toolbar background black. (Only the toolbar.) All Roman letters show up in a nice, clear bold white Tahoma (or something) typeface, but the characters on the language, radical input, handwriting input, list toggle, etc are just reversed out like negatives. They're almost unreadable.
I know there's more, but I can't remember it now. Not to worry. I'll be back. :twisted:
Sandra
Now, a preliminary WM5 report. PlecoDict opens incredibly much faster. A second, maybe. On my x50v, it takes a loooong several seconds.
The tone three pinyin font problem isn't as obvious--the other letters are bold, the third tones are halfway between bold and normal.
The tapping on a character from the list and going directly its definition is the same. If it's the first character in the list, I have to hit the list toggle button. Otherwise, I tap on one of the results in the list and poof, there's the definition. To return to the list, I have to tap on the toggle again. I can't get any screen tap to switch me back to list mode.
And there are the all-too-frequent times when I type in a word, tap on its definition and then can't get back to the list,k not with the toggle, not with taps. I just have to type in a new word and then I go to its definition and can't get out of definition mode and back into list mode. (Using buttonss, taps or drop-down menu--nothing works.)
When I'm stuck in definition mode, the up and down arrows appear (and, yes, work), but I far prefer the list. Also, I have tried to replace the arrows in the toolbar with just about anything else, but to no avail.
I suggest you put a provision in your code to avoid skinning. I'm running WA2 and WAD with one of the Windows Vista themes so popular on the SBSH and Lakeridge forums and it made PD's toolbar background black. (Only the toolbar.) All Roman letters show up in a nice, clear bold white Tahoma (or something) typeface, but the characters on the language, radical input, handwriting input, list toggle, etc are just reversed out like negatives. They're almost unreadable.
I know there's more, but I can't remember it now. Not to worry. I'll be back. :twisted:
Sandra
Here's a clue about why WM5 devices may have trouble handling the PD install onto a storage card. http://www.pocketnow.com/index.php?a=portal_detail&t=reviews&id=702
Do you think this might apply to pd?
Sandra
Do you think this might apply to pd?
Sandra
Oh, guess what? It appears that the dictionary files must be in main memory on my Axim x51v. I tried moving the Oxford dictionaries back to the PlecoDict folder on my SD card and PD couldn't find them. I reset just to be sure, but, alas, if I wanted the Oxfords, I had to put them back in main memory. Damnation. Takes up a lot of space.
Sandra
Sandra
The MUI bug you link to probably isn't affecting PlecoDict, as we don't use MUI (at least not yet). I'm actually not as opposed to the idea of code signing as the author of that article, it's a bit of a nuisance (and certainly Microsoft could have introduced it in a less heavy-handed way) but it's going to make it much harder to crack our copy-protection system and I'm certainly in favor of that. Though they do need to come up with a way for open-source projects to sign their releases for free (unless there's already a mechanism for that that I'm not aware of).
I don't really know much more than you do about which files have to stay in memory and which can be on the card (they all ran fine from the card in Microsoft's simulator), but in general the handwriting recognizer .dll and the .ttf font files are the finickiest about where they're placed, so I'd probably try to avoid moving those and the PlecoDict application program to the storage card.
I'm glad to hear that PlecoDict is starting up faster, though I suspect much of that is due to the files staying in main memory. The font improvement is probably just a matter of Microsoft very slowly addressing the (numerous) issues with their WinCE font rendering code.
Sorry to hear about these other problems - we already have an X50V CE5 upgrade CD on order, so hopefully we'll be able to address them soon. These should all be fixed before the 1.0 release, but I don't imagine too many of our customers will be affected by them before then - given the number of other programs that have issues with CE5 I imagine it'll be quite a while before people start upgrading en masse.
I don't really know much more than you do about which files have to stay in memory and which can be on the card (they all ran fine from the card in Microsoft's simulator), but in general the handwriting recognizer .dll and the .ttf font files are the finickiest about where they're placed, so I'd probably try to avoid moving those and the PlecoDict application program to the storage card.
I'm glad to hear that PlecoDict is starting up faster, though I suspect much of that is due to the files staying in main memory. The font improvement is probably just a matter of Microsoft very slowly addressing the (numerous) issues with their WinCE font rendering code.
Sorry to hear about these other problems - we already have an X50V CE5 upgrade CD on order, so hopefully we'll be able to address them soon. These should all be fixed before the 1.0 release, but I don't imagine too many of our customers will be affected by them before then - given the number of other programs that have issues with CE5 I imagine it'll be quite a while before people start upgrading en masse.
Park He Lin
Member
mikelove said:
Sorry, I should have elaborated?
1. Localization is for English.
2. I downloaded pdbasicppc.exe beta 2.
3. Although PlecoCECheck stated that I have enough space in the main memory of the K-Jam, it would have left me only a MB so I installed it to the minisd card.
4. Upon installation hitting PlecoDict icon the first time brings up a window that states, ?No Dictionaries Installed. Cannot locate any dictionary data files. Please double-check that you?ve correctly installed the files to your Pocket PC.?
5. The second time I hit the PlecoDict icon brings up only an entry box and a menu.
I hope you will be able to alter the program so it runs from the card. I enjoyed PlecoDict so much on my Palm that I delayed switching platforms until the PPC version was announced.
Well yes, that should certainly be fixable - Beta 3 should hopefully be out in about 2 weeks, we're trying to make it a proper "release candidate" version with all known bugs fixed and there's a long list of those to get through
In the meantime, one thing you could try is using the "Oxford Only" version of PlecoDict instead of the Complete one - that would save you from having all of your memory eaten up by a RAM installation.
Thanks for the detailed feedback.
In the meantime, one thing you could try is using the "Oxford Only" version of PlecoDict instead of the Complete one - that would save you from having all of your memory eaten up by a RAM installation.
Thanks for the detailed feedback.
Park He Lin
Member
mikelove said:Well yes, that should certainly be fixable - Beta 3 should hopefully be out in about 2 weeks, we're trying to make it a proper "release candidate" version with all known bugs fixed and there's a long list of those to get through
In the meantime, one thing you could try is using the "Oxford Only" version of PlecoDict instead of the Complete one - that would save you from having all of your memory eaten up by a RAM installation.
Thanks for the detailed feedback.
Great to hear!!! Thanks.
Isn't the pdbasicppc.exe beta 2 version I installed the "Oxford Only" version? If not, I'll try another.
But just to throw another wrench in the monkey...My K-Jam shows 25.54 MB free in storage memory and 27.59 free in program memory. I just now attempted to install pdbasicppc.exe beta 2 on the handheld rather than on the card. I chose ?device.? The installation program wouldn?t allow installation to the device because it said while I need 22292 KB, the device only has 3937 KB. It could be that I am doing something incorrectly or perhaps it?s a quirk of the K-Jam with its WM5. I?ve not had this issue with other programs though.
Oops, yeah, the pdbasicppc.exe one is the Oxford Only version, so if that doesn't work then there isn't much we can do.
The 3937 KB message is rather perplexing - are you sure it isn't reporting on the available memory on your SD card? Is there any chance that some other program could be eating up memory? Or perhaps this is some quirk in how WM5 extracts .cab files, though I certainly hope not since that would make it exceedingly difficult to install PlecoDict (unless we wrote our own installer program, which would take weeks and might make it almost impossible to install from Mac OS or Linux).
The 3937 KB message is rather perplexing - are you sure it isn't reporting on the available memory on your SD card? Is there any chance that some other program could be eating up memory? Or perhaps this is some quirk in how WM5 extracts .cab files, though I certainly hope not since that would make it exceedingly difficult to install PlecoDict (unless we wrote our own installer program, which would take weeks and might make it almost impossible to install from Mac OS or Linux).
OK, we've finally got a WM5 device in hand (Axim x51v) and I think we've figured out the cause of this problem.
It's actually very simple. To cut down on startup time, PlecoDict only searches SD/CF cards to a depth of one level; in other words, it'll only look for files in the "SD Card" directory and in any directory inside of it, but it won't look any deeper than that. So for example, if the data files are located in \\SD Card\Program Files\PlecoDict\, PlecoDict won't be able to find them.
However, Microsoft changed the way that software installs work on WM5, so while on earlier devices PlecoDict would be installed to \\SD Card\Pleco Software PlecoDict\, now it's installed to \\SD Card\Program Files\PlecoDict\ - the extra level of depth is keeping it from finding its data files.
This will be very easy for us to fix in the next beta release, but in the meantime, if you just use File Explorer to move the PlecoDict directory from \\SD Card\Program Files\ to just \\SD Card\, that should get it to start up smoothly.
We should have suspected something like this - a bug in one of the few areas that you can't test without an actual WM5 device in hand.
It's actually very simple. To cut down on startup time, PlecoDict only searches SD/CF cards to a depth of one level; in other words, it'll only look for files in the "SD Card" directory and in any directory inside of it, but it won't look any deeper than that. So for example, if the data files are located in \\SD Card\Program Files\PlecoDict\, PlecoDict won't be able to find them.
However, Microsoft changed the way that software installs work on WM5, so while on earlier devices PlecoDict would be installed to \\SD Card\Pleco Software PlecoDict\, now it's installed to \\SD Card\Program Files\PlecoDict\ - the extra level of depth is keeping it from finding its data files.
This will be very easy for us to fix in the next beta release, but in the meantime, if you just use File Explorer to move the PlecoDict directory from \\SD Card\Program Files\ to just \\SD Card\, that should get it to start up smoothly.
We should have suspected something like this - a bug in one of the few areas that you can't test without an actual WM5 device in hand.
Park He Lin
Member
Okay, this helps some. I initiated installation on the K-Jam the same demo beta 2 pdbasicppc.exe that I had previously downloaded, installed and later removed. I selected Storage Card at the Select Destination Media window. When the Application Download Complete window popped up the K-Jam screen read, ?Installation of Pleco Software PlecoDict.CAB was unsuccessful.? No icon appeared in Start=>Programs on the K-Jam.
Opening Storage Card from Explore on Microsoft ActiveSync revealed the .CAB file at \\Storage Card\. Using File Explore on the K-Jam I double-tapped the .CAB file which initiated installation on the K-Jam. Again I chose Storage Card and Install. Upon completion the K-Jam read, ?Pleco Software PlecoDict.CAB was successfully installed on your device.? Now the .CAB was gone and the folder PlecoDict was indeed at \\Storage Card\Program Files.
I moved the folder PlecoDict to \\Storage Card\. Obviously the shortcut in Start=>Programs would not work because of the move so from File Explorer I double tapped the PlecoDict.exe icon. The opened program displayed the entry box at top and the menu at bottom. There were no icons displayed where I expected: above or to the side of the entry box although by tapping the stylus above the entry area I could see blank white boxes appear. The main central portion of the screen displayed a font size 525 character a1 (meaning pet name prefix) or e1 (meaning cater to), which I assume is the first character in the Oxford C-E Dictionary. From the menu Dict=>Preferences=>Characters I reset the small font size to 16 and this made the definition readable.
I then removed the program from the K-Jam and re-downloaded the same beta 2 pdbasicppc.exe in the event that the original installation .exe was corrupted. After installation the results were the same except the small font size was set at 16 which might mean that the previous removal was incomplete. Next, I removed all 7 files from the PlecoDict folder and placed them directly in \\Storage Card\ but the results were the same.
I hope this info is helpful to you.
Opening Storage Card from Explore on Microsoft ActiveSync revealed the .CAB file at \\Storage Card\. Using File Explore on the K-Jam I double-tapped the .CAB file which initiated installation on the K-Jam. Again I chose Storage Card and Install. Upon completion the K-Jam read, ?Pleco Software PlecoDict.CAB was successfully installed on your device.? Now the .CAB was gone and the folder PlecoDict was indeed at \\Storage Card\Program Files.
I moved the folder PlecoDict to \\Storage Card\. Obviously the shortcut in Start=>Programs would not work because of the move so from File Explorer I double tapped the PlecoDict.exe icon. The opened program displayed the entry box at top and the menu at bottom. There were no icons displayed where I expected: above or to the side of the entry box although by tapping the stylus above the entry area I could see blank white boxes appear. The main central portion of the screen displayed a font size 525 character a1 (meaning pet name prefix) or e1 (meaning cater to), which I assume is the first character in the Oxford C-E Dictionary. From the menu Dict=>Preferences=>Characters I reset the small font size to 16 and this made the definition readable.
I then removed the program from the K-Jam and re-downloaded the same beta 2 pdbasicppc.exe in the event that the original installation .exe was corrupted. After installation the results were the same except the small font size was set at 16 which might mean that the previous removal was incomplete. Next, I removed all 7 files from the PlecoDict folder and placed them directly in \\Storage Card\ but the results were the same.
I hope this info is helpful to you.